Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

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PhilA
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by PhilA » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:24 pm

hankaye wrote:
Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:59 pm
Don't forget that British Pennies were a different "colour" when new then our pennies.
Here's some from 1950. hank
Hank,
Ha! I lived in England for three years but forgot about the color of the penny. I edited the post to say American penny. Thanks for the reminder --Phil
Greenwell
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by Greenwell » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:36 pm

There’s a reason that when pennies were in circulation they were referred to as “coppers”. Still don’t think the colour makes little or no difference. 😎

I fully agree with you on the wire issue, Bazz. Over the years I have tried many, many different wires including bright red and green and all have worked. What I have settled on is a very tractable, penny colored wire that winds perfectly and is the right diameter for the sizes I tie. I bought a lifetime supply for a few bucks about ten years ago. It came on small spools for fly tying and was imported from India.

I would rather fish Pheasant Tail nymphs than any other fly, but in the traditional style of sight fishing. Many fish it as just another nymph, and it's a damn good one, but fishing it in the manner that Sawyer developed is the most fascinating, at least for me, style of angling I know. I remember very well the first trout I saw take my PT and I have never tired of playing this game. Everytime I lift the rod and feel the weight of a hooked trout it's almost as if I've performed a minor act of magic.
Bazzer69
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by Bazzer69 » Tue Dec 11, 2018 2:20 am

Greenwell wrote:
Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:36 pm
There’s a reason that when pennies were in circulation they were referred to as “coppers”. Still don’t think the colour makes little or no difference. 😎

I fully agree with you on the wire issue, Bazz. Over the years I have tried many, many different wires including bright red and green and all have worked. What I have settled on is a very tractable, penny colored wire that winds perfectly and is the right diameter for the sizes I tie. I bought a lifetime supply for a few bucks about ten years ago. It came on small spools for fly tying and was imported from India.

I would rather fish Pheasant Tail nymphs than any other fly, but in the traditional style of sight fishing. Many fish it as just another nymph, and it's a damn good one, but fishing it in the manner that Sawyer developed is the most fascinating, at least for me, style of angling I know. I remember very well the first trout I saw take my PT and I have never tired of playing this game. Everytime I lift the rod and feel the weight of a hooked trout it's almost as if I've performed a minor act of magic.
Very well put, I personally love the takes, landing the fish and releasing it is secondary although exciting!
Love both fly fishing and fly tying, been doing it for a while
But not much good at either
daringduffer
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by daringduffer » Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:39 am

I've seen quite a few genuine Sawyer tied nymphs. Of these the PT:s were tied with 'plain enamel' dark red wire and the Killer Bugs with brighter enameled 'formvar' (?) wire. When discussing the difference i choices, we could not decide whether this was due to availability or design. If the copper wire used in Killer Bugs was supposed to show through the yarn, the brighter choice seemed bright. Likewise, the darker red blends in better on the PT:s.

I have somewhere a small book published by Nick Sawyer, Frank's grandson, but I can't seem to find it. I don't remember if he commented on the colour of wire.

I am not a trout, neither a grayling. Practical experience will show a result, even if it maybe won't show how Frank Sawyer thought about it.

dd
Greenwell
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by Greenwell » Tue Dec 11, 2018 6:24 pm

dd,

I am away on a short business trip but slipped Nick Sawyer's A Guide to Sawyer Nymph Techniques and Frank Sawyer's Nymphing Secretsin my bag to read this evening. A quick scan of the first title turned up this: "....fine red-colored copper wire. The wire we use is little thicker than a human hair and this one can obtain at little cost from various sources."

How red is red? Remember that our Britt friends call hackle "red" that we would call "brown." Of the many original Sawyer flies, and photos of the same, that I have seen over the years, I have never seen any that were dressed with wire that this Yank would call "red." Copper or even copper-brown perhaps, but not "red." This may all be a matter of cultural differences in describing a common color and nothing more. Like I've said before, I've tied PT's with several shades of copper wire and have not found one to be demonstrably better than another.
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ForumGhillie
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by ForumGhillie » Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:26 pm

As long as we are on this subject and we all know not all mayfly nymphs are the same color has anyone tried tying the PT nymphs with dyed pheasant tails?

I should have by tomorrow...
  • Cookshill Select Cock Pheasant Tail (1 Center Tail) - Black Claret
  • Cookshill Select Cock Pheasant Tail (1 Center Tail) - Dark Olive
  • Nature's Spirit Select Pheasant Center Tails - Galloup's Brown Olive
  • Nature's Spirit Select Pheasant Center Tails - Olive
I am looking forward to tying and testing some other PT nymph colors for fun.

John
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PhilA
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by PhilA » Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:53 pm

ForumGhillie wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:26 pm
As long as we are on this subject and we all know not all mayfly nymphs are the same color has anyone tried tying the PT nymphs with dyed pheasant tails?I am looking forward to tying and testing some other PT nymph colors for fun.
John
Ghillie John,
Yes I have! Soft-hackled Pheasant Tails tied with pheasant tail feather barbs dyed red are very effective.
So are those dyed orange.
And, those dyed rusty brown.
And, those dyed olive-brown

There's a trend here. Neither the color of the wire nor the color of the pheasant will dissuade a trout from taking a SHPT presented in the right spot.

Phil
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PhilA
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by PhilA » Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:04 pm

The photos below demonstrate Sawyer's translucency and the effect of red wire showing through overlying wool. The first pair of photos are wet and dry versions of a Killer Bug tied with genuine Chadwick's 477. The second pair of photos are wet/dry versions of a Killer Bug tied with my favorite Chadwick's substitute. The wire was Formvar-insulated AWG38 for both flies.

Image


Image
joaniebo
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by joaniebo » Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:08 pm

Re: dyed pheasant tails, I probably have most of the dyed PTs and have tied nymphs with all of them. That being said , i seem to prefer the natural, black and deep red / wine colors the best. But haven’t really done a day of fishing only PRs if various colors to see what happens.
Bazzer69
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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Post by Bazzer69 » Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:08 pm

PhilA, you tie a nice Killer Bug. Do you use a single
Strand of wool separated from the tri strand wool?
Thanks
Bazza
Love both fly fishing and fly tying, been doing it for a while
But not much good at either
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