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Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 9:17 pm
by billems
Greenwell wrote: Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:01 pm
Bazzer69 wrote: Wed Dec 05, 2018 12:07 pm Thanks for posting. Although I hail from the country once called Great Britain this is the first time I’ve seen a genuine Saywer Nymph. Is there any chance of a close up of his Red PT and the Killer Bug? I’m interested to see the colour of the wire etc he used. He did write a very small book on his upstream nymphing which I once owned but sadly do not any longer. I suspect his source of wire was the lacquered red that was found in small transformers and the like. What strikes me the most about these photos is the fact that they all are pretty “scruffy”. Look at the difference between the top Killer Bug and the bottom one.
Barry

Barry,

The wire color in the Sawyer nymphs I have on the original cards is much more a copper brown than the red that everyone expects. I will try to shoot a couple close up photos of them if I can. In the meantime, here is a shot of one of my PTs tied with wire that is very close to the original. (I have experimented with various wires for PTs for many years and have found that color doesn't seem to matter: size and suppleness are more important. The very best that I have found is some inexpensive stuff from India!) Pheasant Tail Nymph.jpg
This fly is on a TMC 3769 size 14, a shorter hook than Sawyer used but one that has been my choice for these flies for over 30 years. Sight fishing with PT nymphs is by far my favorite method of fly fishing. It's a stalker's game and demands a great deal of observation and concentration. I have never tired of it.
I have a friend who is accomplished in the same skill. It's beautiful thing to see, and is perhaps apex of stream trouting. If you're going to nymph, that's the style that impresses me. I've managed to pull it off a few times, but have much admiration for those that do.

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 9:18 pm
by billems
The old recipes mention "red," but even the original Sawyers exhibited copper. I'm thinking that they called the copper color, "red."

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 9:45 pm
by wsbailey
Something like this is the right stuff.

https://www.remingtonindustries.com/mag ... gJt0PD_BwE

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2021 1:41 pm
by Theroe
I’ve always disagreed with most everyone on this: with regard to any copper items you have new, and old. If you take your pocket change and look at it, a new penny is reddish and an old Penny is brownish. I firmly believe that Sawyer meant to use new red wire, not enameled wire. Just my two cents….

Pun intended!!!

Dana

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2021 1:44 pm
by DUBBN
Theroe wrote: Thu Oct 07, 2021 1:41 pm I’ve always disagreed with most everyone on this: with regard to any copper items you have new, and old. If you take your pocket change and look at it, a new penny is reddish and an old Penny is brownish. I firmly believe that Sawyer meant to use new red wire, not enameled wire. Just my two cents….

Pun intended!!!

Dana
I disagree. Copper is a metal and a color. It is not red, or even a shade of red.

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2021 2:39 pm
by Theroe
DUBBN wrote: Thu Oct 07, 2021 1:44 pm
Theroe wrote: Thu Oct 07, 2021 1:41 pm I’ve always disagreed with most everyone on this: with regard to any copper items you have new, and old. If you take your pocket change and look at it, a new penny is reddish and an old Penny is brownish. I firmly believe that Sawyer meant to use new red wire, not enameled wire. Just my two cents….

Pun intended!!!

Dana
I disagree. Copper is a metal and a color. It is not red, or even a shade of red.
Multiple points of view are always welcome……
My point is: in the genuine flies as tied by Sawyer, seen in the initial post show the wire is clearly an untarnished copper color; not enameled.

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 3:06 pm
by billems
Sawyer often spoke of the pt wire as "red" in color. But copper wire has often been termed as "red" by the English. My beagle is ginger colored. But I could just as easily say he's red. So, copper it is for the pheasant tail. That is...according to ME! (lol)

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 7:08 pm
by Mike62
I have no idea what the fish think of copper wire; I doubt they give a rats arse. But I do.

Me, I have always been a fan of the deeper, darker, copper colors. The standard run of the mill stuff we buy today, from the various purveyors of such things, excites me not; it's so... bland. I've got a lifetimes supply of vintage wire, in various sizes, from days of yore; all wound on old crumbling wooden spools, all with a much deeper, red-ish hue to it. Some of this wire has a wax coating on it that must be scraped off (I run it between fingernails) before tying with it. I haven't noticed the wire oxidizing after I scrape the wax off..., but maybe I just haven't been paying enough attention either.

Maybe I just like tying with old materials. I'm going to go with that...

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 8:43 pm
by wsbailey

Re: Frank Sawyer's Nymphs

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:50 pm
by DUBBN