Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

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hankaye
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by hankaye » Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:47 am

Old Hat, Howdy;

Carl, it's really hard to hear the words on my computer...........even when I shut-down everything in the trailer .......................

just as I think I hear somthing ..............................

I realize that it was just the dog (Rascal), farting quietly in the background....... :lol: :lol: :lol:

So, I'll just continue to READ what's on here and take somethings with a grain of salt........ the remainder gets my full attention.

hank
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of consecutive days I've stayed alive." George Carlin
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by letumgo » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:33 pm

Hank - Yes, you are understanding correctly. The feather is tyed in at roughly the 10 O'Clock position (looking from the front towards the eye). The feather good side is towards the tyer (another way to think of it is that the bird's side of the feather is against the hook shank).

I though of another point that can be helpful. When preparing the feather, you can gauge the amount of hackles on the hook by comparing it with the length of the hook shank. If you look carefully at the photo where the hackle has just been tyed onto the hook, you will see that the hackles are a little more than half of the shank length. If you want fewer hackle fibers, just strip them off before tying in the feather. This is an easy way to get consistent hackling from one fly to the next (not that the fish care).

Thanks guys. Glad the tutorial is useful.

Carl - I am normally a "tye it in by the stem" guy, but I got better results with the grouse feather with the tip-tyed method.
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by letumgo » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:44 pm

CreationBear - The Pearsall's Marabou silk is heavy enough to tye sizes up to salmon flies, but I would recommend still splitting it apart into the smaller strands before wrapping with it. You will get a much smoother body after the strands have been separated. Pearsall's also sells "Stout" silk, which is made intentionally for steelhead/salmon fishing flies. I have only tyed with the Stout on one occasion. I seem to remember it being straighter than the Marabou stuff. If you want VERY smooth silk bodies, invest in the Japanese JES silk. It is expensive, but this stuff is SMOOTH....
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by CreationBear » Tue Feb 15, 2011 1:13 pm

letumgo-- Yes, this weekend was one of those times when suddenly everything had to have a silk body. (Of course, I still can't bear to forgo putting a thorax on 'em. :lol: It's been a few days in the 60's down here in Tennessee, so I'm looking forward to drifting some of your "PK's Royalty Payment's" through the next BWO hatch I see.)
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by hankaye » Tue Feb 15, 2011 1:17 pm

Ray, Re-Howdy;
letumgo wrote:Hank - Yes, you are understanding correctly. The feather is tyed in at roughly the 10 O'Clock position (looking from the front towards the eye).
Engineers ..................ask about one direction and they refer ya to another....That said, so if I look from the butt to the eye it would be at 2:00 and from the eye to the butt it would be at 10:00...?

The feather good side is towards the tyer (another way to think of it is that the bird's side of the feather is against the hook shank).
Shiney side UP.

I though of another point that can be helpful. When preparing the feather, you can gauge the amount of hackles on the hook by comparing it with the length of the hook shank. If you look carefully at the photo where the hackle has just been tyed onto the hook, you will see that the hackles are a little more than half of the shank length. If you want fewer hackle fibers, just strip them off before tying in the feather. This is an easy way to get consistent hackling from one fly to the next (not that the fish care).

Thanks guys. Glad the tutorial is useful.

Carl - I am normally a "tye it in by the stem" guy, but I got better results with the grouse feather with the tip-tyed method.
Why is that? fragility of the feather?

hank
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by letumgo » Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:30 pm

Sorry about the frame of reference thing. I realized we were saying the same thing, after I went back and read your post, but it was too late to edit my answer.

As my wife has told me many times, look at the eyes, not the butt. (tasteless joke) :lol:
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by hankaye » Tue Feb 15, 2011 7:30 pm

Ray, Howdy;

:lol: :lol: :lol:

When I was fixing helicopters for a living the #1 target on my radar was the engineer that designed the part that brokedown the most.....

It was generally buried behind the parts that never brokedown.....they were the larger and heavier ones as well...........wouldn't ya know.....

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

hank
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by willowhead » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:18 am

hank, there are many terms that may confuse you in the beginning. For instance you say "shinny side up." Actually it's shinny side down. You want the dull (what is also known, as the good side) side up. What Ray is saying is that the side that is "the bird's side," is the side you want down, or away from you. When he says, "the birds side".....he means the side of the feather that touches the birds skin. And that is the shinny side.
The outside of the feathers.....that which does NOT touch the birds skin, is the dull or GOOD side. Got it? ;)
And, if you look at the pic closely.....you'll see that Ray has actually got the feather tyed in at 9 o'clock. i usually tye in at 11 o'clock. Also, the main reasons for tying in by the butt (or stem end) is because you'll be dealing with the longest fibers right off the bat.....so if you want just a few fibers, one turn or so.....do it that way. If you want more fibers, with the last ones being the longest.....tye in by the tip. That way you get the shorter fibers first and the longest in the last couple turns, and consequently, a fuller looking collar. ;)
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by hankaye » Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:46 am

willowhead wrote:hank, there are many terms that may confuse you in the beginning. For instance you say "shinny side up." Actually it's shinny side down. You want the dull (what is also known, as the good side) side up. What Ray is saying is that the side that is "the bird's side," is the side you want down, or away from you. When he says, "the birds side".....he means the side of the feather that touches the birds skin. And that is the shinny side.
The outside of the feathers.....that which does NOT touch the birds skin, is the dull or GOOD side. Got it? ;)
I went back to cb 'Trucker speak' keep the shiney side up equals keep it on the tires. Guess it all boils down to concave side down
And, if you look at the pic closely.....you'll see that Ray has actually got the feather tyed in at 9 o'clock. i usually tye in at 11 o'clock.
On sumtin that small one or two hours dosen't really matter ........does it?
Also, the main reasons for tying in by the butt (or stem end) is because you'll be dealing with the longest fibers right off the bat.....so if you want just a few fibers, one turn or so.....do it that way. If you want more fibers, with the last ones being the longest.....tye in by the tip. That way you get the shorter fibers first and the longest in the last couple turns, and consequently, a fuller looking collar. ;) And because that's the way Mr. Nemes did it??
I feel that if I am doing something "to honor" of someone that did stuff like this I would do it the way They did it.

Althought an interpurpitive representation is good, they have their place IMHO. Kinda like the folks that 'feel' they have to jazz up or attempt to warbble the National Anthem. It ain't about them Just sing the song the way it was written. It stands on it's own. Again IMHO

hank
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of consecutive days I've stayed alive." George Carlin
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Re: Tutorial - Tying a Grouse and Orange Soft Hackle

Post by kanutripr » Wed Feb 16, 2011 11:11 am

hankaye wrote:
Althought an interpurpitive representation is good, they have their place IMHO. Kinda like the folks that 'feel' they have to jazz up or attempt to warbble the National Anthem. It ain't about them Just sing the song the way it was written. It stands on it's own. Again IMHO

hank
Amen Hank. Boring I know but on this we do agree!


Vicki
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