Hook rants and other nonsense

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tie2fish
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by tie2fish » Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:22 am

WiFlyfisher wrote:
tie2fish wrote:
WiFlyfisher wrote:More of my nonsense comments:

Have you seen Competitive Angler's Cookshill offering? https://competitiveangler.com/product-c ... rs-hackle/

John
Thank you very much for this link, John. Looks yummy.
Bill,
If you ever stoop to using beads (I do for some nymphs) they have the best quality, tight fitting, heavy tungsten beads I have ever used. They are by far not the cheapest, but the best TG beads, in my opinion. I personally really like the "light coffee" color. https://competitiveangler.com/shop/bead ... s-25-pack/.
I do use the occasional bead, John, but they are nearly always black.
Some of the same morons who throw their trash around in National parks also vote. That alone would explain the state of American politics. ~ John Gierach, "Still Life with Brook Trout"
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Smuggler
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by Smuggler » Tue Jul 24, 2018 11:14 am

Nice hooks you've got there ;)
daringduffer
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by daringduffer » Tue Jul 24, 2018 2:17 pm

I hear what you say, narco. BRF was just an example of a well known business, not as a 'our niche supplier'. Are you telling us you bought a Marryat rod? They have a very good reputation for 'our' fishing in UK. Philip Bailey/Bob Smith used to sell them.

dd
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by narcodog » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:15 pm

daringduffer wrote:I hear what you say, narco. BRF was just an example of a well known business, not as a 'our niche supplier'. Are you telling us you bought a Marryat rod? They have a very good reputation for 'our' fishing in UK. Philip Bailey/Bob Smith used to sell them.

dd
Yes I did.
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Theroe
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by Theroe » Wed Jul 25, 2018 12:21 pm

WiFlyfisher wrote:More of my nonsense comments:

1) Dana, don't give narcobuddy +2, it will go to his head.

2) Hen capes for soft hackles - I feel Collin's hen capes are the best by far and they are more difficult for me to find.

3) Other types of bird feathers - today, I buy from BRF or Cookshill for quality soft hackle bird skins
Originally I bought my first Cookshill from Jim, then Great Feathers and now direct from Cookshills a couple times a year.

Have you seen Competitive Angler's Cookshill offering? https://competitiveangler.com/product-c ... rs-hackle/

I have bought a lot from them because they offer a lot of unique, quality items, versus the everyday brands like Hareline, Wapsi & Whiting.

John
sorry - the combination of Fulling Mill 50 packs & Pearsalls in the same photo intoxicates me a bit.
Also - i hardly use beads, usually black or brown tungsten for weight purposes. WholesaleFlyCompany has top quality beads & hooks cheaper than anywhere I have ever seen.....1/8" tungsten beads for $10/100, hooks $7/100

And Yes I love Cookshill.....

Dana
Soft and wet - the only way....
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Smuggler
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by Smuggler » Wed Jul 25, 2018 1:45 pm

John's right - The beads from CA are very nice quality. I will say though... his source is sometimes wonky with supply.
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Smuggler
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by Smuggler » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:11 pm

Sporadic.
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Theroe
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by Theroe » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:18 pm

i should have been clear: I believe they are of the same origin. And yes, the hook is by far the least expensive component of an anglers regalia, BUT - I just don't like to overpay for things. Trends being what they are, the packaging gets smaller as the price reaches the sky.

20 hooks for $7.95 :o :o :o

$75-100 for a chicken neck :( :o :(


not fo rme
Soft and wet - the only way....
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Old Hat
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by Old Hat » Sat Jul 28, 2018 9:17 am

Great ramblings and gentlemen rants going on here.

I too generally prefer the bronze hooks. Although there are certain patterns of mine that I prefer the black nickel. I have found these are almost always on dark patterns where the hook will "blend" in with the scheme of the pattern and become apart of the imitation itself.

As far as obtaining materials though, I don't think I have ever ordered anything from overseas or across borders. It is almost impossible now to get traditional soft hackle material from established businesses in the US. It is not overly easy to get good quality non-traditional materials either without searching around the internet at a variety of different places. I used to order quite a bit online from a few and was happy with the selection but they have wained in material or have gotten out of it completely. Bob is correct in his explanation why. Simple, it is cost prohibitive for businesses to import material for such a small market. It is not worth the time, effort, or money.

We are a fickle bunch. We enjoy simplicity. We like quality. We relish tradition. We are creative tiers but we operate in self imposed narrow parameters. As far as from a business perspective, we are not worth it. On top of all that we just can't get passed the idea that the materials used centuries ago are the bees knees, worth a premier price and nearly irreplaceable. We have essentially tied our own noose, especially in the States, to accessibility of materials for our chosen niche. I thoroughly enjoy the traditions of wet flies, spiders, flymphs etc. I have a skin or hackle for just about all the traditional legal patterns. I've decided when they are gone, they are gone. Same with all my Pearsall's. I milk them now, using them only for special occasions.

When the forefathers of our sport were blazing the trails they selected the best quality, most appropriate (size, colors etc) of material they could find LOCALLY. They selected from was available to them. For the most part, we have refused to embrace this idea in the states. We just haven't put the effort into it. Part of it is tradition, but I think a lot of it is the unfounded idea that materials from old world are better. We have more selection and easier access to furs and hackles here in the states than most of the world. Yet tiers in our niche have focused so much on tradition that we have barely explored what we have in our backyard. What little we have done, is mostly in attempt to get as close to a traditional material as possible instead of clearing our own path.

Blue Ribbon has come the closest I know of any shop who has tried to embrace this idea, but it simply won't take off and find it's way into other shops until tradition loosens its grip on our sport in the States. Don't read this wrong, I believe the traditions of our little section of this sport are very important and enjoyable. If we want local access at shops to quality materials, we should be finding creative patterns and techniques using local and regional sources and less concentration in materials steeped in the traditions of the past from overseas markets. I would love to go into a local fly shop and see a great selection of regional soft hackle material from hooks to hackle. I don't need the partridge hook, the Pearsall's silk or the golden plover and neither do the fish. In fact, we may find that Catskill trout prefer cheeseburgers and fries to bangers and mash.
I hate it when I think I'm buying organic vegetables, and when I get home I discover they are just regular donuts.
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wsbailey
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Re: Hook rants and other nonsense

Post by wsbailey » Sat Jul 28, 2018 9:40 am

Datus Proper was one of the few tyers to recommend American game birds. Leisenring was tethered to British tradition even though his flies represented American insects. While not exactly the same; several of our game birds make good substitutes for the game birds in British angling literature. Side by side the feathers may look different but on a hook are hard to tell apart.
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