Couple more tying questions

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dj1212
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Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:13 pm

Couple more tying questions

Post by dj1212 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 8:43 pm

So I was thinking about a couple of things relating to tying North country spiders. Wondering how others do it. When you're tying a fly that calls for the body to be made with the tying silk how many layers of thread do you use? I normally tie in the thread near the eye and then wind down the hook and back to where the hackle would be. It makes for a very thin body. is this the right way to do it or do you form a tapered body with the thread?

Also as for the hackle what do you think are the proper proportions? That is how long should the hackle be for the hook size? Also how many turns of hackle do you normally use.

Hope you all don't mind the questions. Thanks
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hankaye
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Re: Couple more tying questions

Post by hankaye » Sun Sep 16, 2018 9:03 pm

dj1212, Howdy;

First allow me to offer you a warm welcome to the forum. Nose around into the members only
(not the jackets), sections tucked into Links you should find a baby forum titled ref. material.
the weight of the universe (not really), is in there in knowledge.
Please take a small bit of time to introduce yourself, it helps us to help you. If you are already
a tyer then you know the basics and tyer speak is not a hurdle. If you are a novice as I was then
these folks can break it down to the basics for ya. They are great! annnnd they love questions! :D
Welcome aboard.

hank
Striving for a less complicated life since 1949...
dj1212
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:13 pm

Re: Couple more tying questions

Post by dj1212 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 11:58 pm

Thanks for the welcome. A little about me. I first got into fly fishing for trout when I was 19 - 20 years old. A long time ago. lol I'm now 67. I live in Virginia so the first trout I caught were from small mountain streams where most trout in Va. are found. I soon discovered Shenandoah National Park and native brook trout. I've pretty much always tied my own flies. I thought I would save money. :) Not long after that I discovered split bamboo fly rods. Also started fishing some of the spring creeks in Penn. Falling Springs and the Letort as well as others. I've also spent time fishing in the Catskills in N.Y. The Beaverkill and Willowemoc. Also fished a little in Vermont and New Hampshire. One trip to Yellowstone a long time ago and Colorado. Most of my fishing has been in Pa. and Va. Have also done alot of rod work on bamboo fly rods. I've always pretty much always fished dry flies but I like spiders and soft hackles as emergers and swimming nymphs. I do get into tying the soft hackles though. And I like trying to tie the old patterns from Pritt and Edmonds and Lee.

So there's a little about my fly fishing experience. I hope before long to have some sort of digital camera so i can post some photos of my flies.

Doug
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tie2fish
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Re: Couple more tying questions

Post by tie2fish » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:56 am

Doug ~
North Country spiders are almost universally tied with just two thread layers, down and back as you describe. The old masters apparently did not feel that it was necessary to make their flies look "natural" (tapered body) -- only suggestive.
As for hackle, it depends on what era you wish to emulate. Modern standards call for sparse hackle that is relatively short, while many of the old patterns -- if illustrations and surviving specimens are to be believed -- had long and sometimes almost bushy hackle. If you have fished spider flies much, you have no doubt noticed that some of the hackle barbs get chewed off by every fish and/or abraded by stream structure, so a "bushy" fly becomes less so in short order.

The number of turns required to get the desired number of barbs varies with the type of feather you are using, as some feathers are more dense than others. Tiers who prefer to use modern proportions will sometimes strip the barbs off one side of the hackle feather to obtain the sparse look they prefer.
In ancient times, cats were worshipped as gods; they have not forgotten this.
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hankaye
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Re: Couple more tying questions

Post by hankaye » Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:19 am

dj1212, Howdy;

Doug, thanks for the short bio. Helps, I believe, that folks know something about
a person so they don't appear to talk down to them, such as offering the most basic
information to a highly experienced tyer by not knowing what the person's skill
level might be.The result may be unintentionally chasing away a library of information.

When I first came to this forum I was a non "tye" speaking novice now, after about 8
years I still get in trouble. :lol:

Thanks again for joining and for the short bio.

hank
Striving for a less complicated life since 1949...
dj1212
Posts: 27
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:13 pm

Re: Couple more tying questions

Post by dj1212 » Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:51 am

Hank,

Thanks for the welcome. I always try to be open minded about fly fishing. I'll never learn it all and I think that's one of the things that keeps me interested in fishing and tying flies. On the one hand there's always something new to learn and yet on the other hand there's rarely anything completely new in fly fishing and tying. New materials for rods and flies but not much more. Just my opinion. I've always seemed to like the more classic stuff. Bamboo rods and classic fly patterns. Like these wet flies and the catskill style dries for trout fishing.

Again thanks.

Doug
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Old Hat
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Re: Couple more tying questions

Post by Old Hat » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:53 pm

You will often see proper hackle length described as ending somewhere between the point and the end of the hook. This is where I generally tie. I have done well with partridge and yellow, red and orange on stillwater. These I will tie a little longer so the hackle "swims" a bit when I am stripping the fly in.
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