Partridge Hackle

[Boris]

What's the accepted way to tie the feather in - laying back over the shank, or forward over the eye?

[DUBBN]

You may start a Flymph Forum war with that question.

I prefer over the eye. Just an opinion. Don't want to step on any toes here!

[letumgo]

I have used both methods, in addition to tip tyed. They can all be used effectively. I most often tye in the feather by the stem, facing out over the eye of the hook.

[Boris]

You may start a Flymph Forum war with that question.

I prefer over the eye. Just an opinion. Don't want to step on any toes here!

Thanks.

I didn't realise there were entrenched camps on each position.

Ok, so it's not super crittical, but is the effect the same? I tried to make some soft hackles on the weekend and found the partridge hackle a bit tricky. Anyway, I can see it'll take a bit of practice in fine motor skills.

[William Anderson]

the correct way is to tie in by the stem, leaving the hackle out over the eye. tying in by the tip just doesn't work.

Just kidding. You'll get good at one way over the other and favor it...but it really doesn't matter...if you don't mind weak hackles and unsightly heads.

No, I'm just kidding, I saw a guy catch a Brookie on a fly hacked the wing way once...so it must work sometimes. He seemed pleased enough.

[gingerdun]

Boris,

Here is an illustration from THE ART OF TYING THE WET FLY by Leisenring and Hidy.
They recommended 3 or 4 turns of thread before tying the stem down, and then 5 or 6 to secure it.
But for palmer hackles, tie in the tip closer to the bend.

[Boris]

I have used both methods, in addition to tip tyed.

Ray,

I thought 'tip tied' was a given, but I see from Lance's diagram it's personal preference or horses for courses.

I wouldn't know if brookies have a much of a reputation for being fly fussy.

Thanks again.

[Jerry G]

Boris by saying you found using partridge a bit tricky I assume you mean breaking stems. If that is the case I think the illustartions Lance has shared is the route to go as I find with this technique if there is a breakage it will likely be at the thinest part of the stem which is where the hackle pliers is holding the feather. With that happening I simply have to reattach the pliers. Now if you attach in reverse of this the thinest part of the feather will be at the tie in. A breakage there and you will have to retie. As has been said though as you tie more soft hackle you will find a personal preference that most times will work best for you.

Regards, Jerry

[Boris]

Jerry,

breakage was one issue but I also found the barbs when winding on the hackle tended to leave gaps. Not the evenly spaced ones expected with sparse hackles but ones that make you think there's a distribution problem as the feather is wound. I checked that there wasn't any missing barbs and all was well there. After thinking about it I did notice the feather tended to twist sending barbs forward and every which way. Perhaps that may have caused it.

I'm waiting for varnish & glue to dry so I might have another go this week and see if I can improve on the dismal results so far.

[Mataura mayfly]

Boris, you using hackles from a pack of feathers or off a skin? How long have you had them sitting around before deciding to use them? Feather stems can get brittle if the have a fair age on them, but then as we are more used to rooster hackle than Partridge we tend to be a bit heavy handed when wrapping...... which will also lead to breakage.
Also, define gappy? Some would just call that sparse, which is not a bad thing. I tend to over hackle softies, because at the time of making it looks better- fuller, but the finished fly is often overpowered by the hackle.
Tied in by the tip, fibres doubled and stroked back and one to two full wraps seems to give the neatest result for me....... but I will use all the above methods from time to time. Some feathers are just demented and have a mind of their own when wrapping. You get fibres poking out or trapped in at all kinds of angles and it looks like heck, but if you are using #14 thread and don't have too much build up at the head already you can sweep all the fibres back with your left hand (right hand tier) and three or four wraps back over the butts of the fibres will have them all facing the right way, whip finish and your done.

To be honest mate, photos. We need photos. Nobody is going to laugh you off the board here, we all started from scratch at some time or another. Put up photos of what you have tied and you will find honest advise will flow forth from your computer screen helping you wrap the perfect Partridge hackle.