Clark's dubbing block

[Mataura mayfly]

Oh well, if you like 'em use 'em...... if you don't- don't.

Each of us will have prefered methods and special "tricks & traits" in our tying and never 100% agree with each other, but having just discovered pre-spun bodies and the ability to see what happens with different threads- waxes and dubbings I am both liking the results and enjoying the method.

[Jim Slattery]

Hi Mike!
Not that I expect anyone to agree with this but I feel that there is an intrinsic quality that is given to flies tied using Leisenring's spun method,. Something that is even missed using the dubbing block.
Another thought IF you are going to tie a fly with dubbing spun between 2 strands of SILK this technique allows for maximum precision of body placement and in turn fly tying as well. A fellow Wingless Wet enthusiast had similar thoughts as you who stayed at my place last summer. After showing hin the subtle differences he was starting to see what I was trying to convey. He then pointed out that the pre spun bodies would be great for sizes 10 to maybe 16 but would not work on anything smaller. To be honest I couldn't disagree with him as I never had tied anything smaller than 16s as I do not usually fish with flies that small. I said "well let's see". I put a size 20 Daiichi 1550 wet fly hook in the vise and proceeded to tie a properly proportioned slim Thorax Flymph. Using gossamer thread. I could probably squeeze out a size 22 but it would be a challange. I have to say though I was suprised.
Just my thoughts
Jim

[Kelly L.]

Thanks for the thoughts, and tips. Jim, that is a good idea, I am gonna try that!!

[Mike Connor]

Hi Mike!
Not that I expect anyone to agree with this but I feel that there is an intrinsic quality that is given to flies tied using Leisenring's spun method,. Something that is even missed using the dubbing block.
Another thought IF you are going to tie a fly with dubbing spun between 2 strands of SILK this technique allows for maximum precision of body placement and in turn fly tying as well. A fellow Wingless Wet enthusiast had similar thoughts as you who stayed at my place last summer. After showing hin the subtle differences he was starting to see what I was trying to convey. He then pointed out that the pre spun bodies would be great for sizes 10 to maybe 16 but would not work on anything smaller. To be honest I couldn't disagree with him as I never had tied anything smaller than 16s as I do not usually fish with flies that small. I said "well let's see". I put a size 20 Daiichi 1550 wet fly hook in the vise and proceeded to tie a properly proportioned slim Thorax Flymph. Using gossamer thread. I could probably squeeze out a size 22 but it would be a challange. I have to say though I was suprised.
Just my thoughts
Jim

That's fair enough Jim, each to his own.

TL
MC

[gingerdun]

Hi Jim,

I realise that this is something of a traditional Leisenring thing, but I never saw any particular advantage in it, indeed, all I can see are disadvantages!

TL
MC

Mike, You have some of the most interesting and informative posts on the forum. I really appreciate the time you take to share your knowledge. I'm learning a lot from you.
About the quote above, I think that most tiers would probably agree with you. Not much of a chance that the pre-spun body technique will be widely adopted. Like you say, way too many disadvantages.

Leisenring and Hidy maintained that there were some advantages, however, from their old-fashioned point of view. They said the spun body was tough, and would last longer, standing up to the gnawing of the trout teeth. They also liked to have a variety of sizes and colors on store for an emergency match-the-hatch situation. And when they went to the trouble of preparing a special dubbing cut or blend, they liked to quickly tie a card or two of bodies for future use, which went faster than tying the flies.

For myself, I actually enjoy the whole process of making the spun bodies. It is just another part of the craft, which when done well, gives me a good feeling—especially since it involves so many little decisions at each step. Takes a lot of practice to get it right.

About the wax, like Leisenring and Hidy I just use the hard wax that I soften between my fingers, not very sticky at all. Doesn't need to be, since when you lay the dubbing on the thread, it isn't going anywhere.

I know Jim Slattery is a purist, spinning the bodies Leisenring-style, on his pants leg. But one reason Pete Hidy liked the spinning block was that he could put it conveniently on the table, maybe on a thick book to raise it up. Ergonomically this is better, since you don't have to bend over as far to inspect the dubbing while you are carefully depositing the tiny clumps of cut fur, one tweezer-tip batch at a time, on the single strand of silk. I would estimate that it took about six or seven tweezer-batches to apply enough dubbing for the first body on the card below.

After a half hour the twisted thread has set enough so you can safely remove the body from the card for tying. It will untwist some, but not enough to release the dubbing. I re-twist it after tying it to the hook, near the bend. If you set the body overnight, it holds the twist better when you remove it from the card, so long as you use silk. Other kinds of thread don't set as well as silk does.

Here is a card with some bodies I tied in December, with size 18 hooks in mind. And a fly I tied this morning with the first body on the card.

Hook; 18 wide gape, maker unknown
Thread: Amber Pearsall's gossamer silk
Hackle: Ashy hen with ginger tips
Body: Hare's poll and mole on Primrose silk
Tail: Lemon wood duck
Rib: Fine gold tinsel

[tie2fish]

Oh my goodness! That is an absolutely gorgeous fly, G'dun.

[Kelly L.]

Very interesting thoughts Gingerdun, and I loved the photos too!

[narcodog]

Jim has shown me how to do the loop on the pants and I had a time getting my finger to work. I have since refined my fingers and now can do better a job. Anyway not all pant material are made the same which along with the color of the material can influence the color and structure of the noodle. Jim also pointed that out to me.

[Mike Connor]

I have used a dubbing block quite a lot in the past, and I still have a couple, but that is quite a long time ago now. I began fly dressing many years ago, initially without a vice, then with a vice but without a bobbin holder. Once I made my first bobbin holder there was no need to use the dubbing block any more because I then had decent control of my thread. Unless you have actually done these things it is hard to imagine the difficulties involved in some operations. Even a relatively "simple" thing like spinning the bobbin holder to achieve various thread actions or configurations was once quite impossible, as there were no bobbin holders! For a while I did use hackle pliers clamped to a piece of thread, which I then dubbed and used as a "ribbing". At the time this was considered quite "revolutionary" by some!

Over the years, now more than half a century, I have endeavoured to learn as many tricks and techniques as I could, among a lot of other stuff, including various material properties and as much about the insects I was attempting to imitate as possible. I don't use all the techniques any more. There has been a great deal of development over the years in various areas and I have more or less settled on techniques that suit me or are particularly suited to obtaining certain effects.

If people enjoy using certain techniques, or consider them advantageous for various reasons, or just like using them, it doesn't really matter, there is no reason they should not do so.

Fly-dressing is all about control and the knowledge of materials. The main reason I don't use dubbing blocks any more is the lack of control. One thing I learned very quickly is that preparing materials beforehand made for much better flies, and doubtless there is this effect when using prepared dubbing loops so from that aspect it is not a bad thing, but otherwise it simply does not suit me so I don't do it!

TL
MC

[Mataura mayfly]

Try as I might, I am still having trouble splitting fine copper wire to insert dubbing. Having the same woes with tinsel and flashybou...... but with my very limited experience with the Clark block (experience that can be measured in days if not hours! ) I have made some very interesting pre-formed bodies using these materials as the thread, easire than I can by touch dubbing....... I am a ham fisted son of a gun though.